It looks to be the week for finding foolish bloggers. First we had gaming will save the world and now we have this over at Fame & Fortune.
The assumption in all this is the girls are weak. Oh that's not he said, but it's certainly what he implied. That from a market PoV they have no impact on product sales and thus the only thing being made is various 'objectification' products that only service a small part of the total market.
I call BS, on both claims.
The author of the post had no trouble presenting four popular counter examples (including one of my favorite fantasy characters) to the Buffy/Xena ones from his linked presentation. Nor did he have trouble finding an example of a woman who's into D&D while wearing plunging neckline fantasy costumes- thus nicely wreaking both sides of that point.
Further, this statement: "Offending a third of your audience to provide just about half with cheap thrills is poor design" is foolish in the extreme. Ford didn't outsell GM this year by avoiding offending people who think trucks and SUV are wrecking the planet- they did it by selling trucks and SUVs to people who wanted them.
Sales is about niches far more often than not. Niches always offend some, and appeal to others. That's life, get use to it.
If girls are an important part of this hobby (they certainly have been in my gaming life), and if they want a different type of product that what is being produced- they can make it themselves or buy it from someone who does. They don't need us to do it for them. And it's insult to women to suggest that we need to.
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6 comments:
I like the you buy from people who make what you want point.
I'd agree with you, but I was too busy making sammiches in the kitchen to pay attention to what you big strong menfolk are writing about your complicated hobbies. Perhaps if these games had less math and more ponies.
FFS, people. We're not "women gamers." We're gamers. Want us to buy your games? Make good games.
My experiences with gamers who happen to be female isn't massive, but I've played with about a half dozen enthusiastic girls over the years and one thing I've found is that when they get into the game... they do things that most guys wouldn't even consider. They cut to the heart of emotions and inner turmoil and usually twist the knife gleefully as GM's and can make far-more callous morality calls than most men would. This is not a bad thing, they've made for really exciting games.
The thing is, what features in games are there not enough of to interest gamers like this? I know Vampire larp's did a lot to attract girls to the hobby back in the 90's, but what new additions are girls interested in now?
cassey: The nice thing about the free market (when it is *free*) is that it will adjust to the buyers unless those buyers waste their money on things that don't suit them.
Swordgleam: I think you make your point very well. And in fewer words than I took.
Helmsman: I don't think there is a single answer to "what new additions are girls interested in now?" any more than there is an single answer to "what do gamers want now?".
Ask a dozen different people and you'll likely get a dozen different answers.
IME, they'll bring what they want to the game themselves. And ignore anything that they don't like.
Which is basically the same thing males do.
complete rubbish. If the industry is run by guys squeezing girls out of the industry, there'll never be anyone making products women want, or even thinking about whether what women want is relevant.
You may have noticed recently the OSR tearing itself apart over porn. What you would also have noticed is the way none of the men debating porn ever stopped to consider whether the way they spoke about the women at the centre of the issue might be rude, or just plain stupid. The same weekend we see pictures of garycon, composed entirely of men.
What is this telling women who might be interested in the hobby?
Unlike you faustusnotes, I'm rather certain that the women are more than capable of doing whatever they want.
If they want to game, they'll game. If they want to publish games, they'll publish games.
They don't need my or your help to do either, and neither of us could stop them (outside our own gaming table) even if we were stupid enough to want to.
Dude, if it conventions were the only message for gamers (female or not)- I WOULDN'T BE A GAMER.
It's likely a good thing then that I know of no gamers out of the dozens I've played with who were introduced to the hobby by the a conventions.
I don't really have a comment on whatever happened with the OSR people. Not something I'm interesting in and I know very little about it.
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